Welsh Sec D -are they all they are cracked up to be??

fairlady

fairlady

New Member
Jul 14, 2007
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now as most of you know I am first and foremost an Arab Lover - however, I have bought myself a Welsh Sec D.

I have always liked the Welshies, very pretty heads, in fact, Arabby heads, not suprising as there is Arab in the Welshie bloodlines.

Morse has the body of a Welsh Sec D, but I think, a very pretty Arabby head and I guess that is what attracted me to him.

However, we have not been without a few problems, admittedley some of them MY FAULT, and I have now rectified my handling of him being a bit firmer and we are getting along just famously, and I can honestly say now that he has won me over and I love him and I am looking forward to working with him, riding him, etc.

However, I have been on another forum tonight, losts of Welshie owners on there and they all seem to be saying the same thing. Welsh Sec D and Arabs are not a million miles apart and need a different kind of handling. If given the wrong, too soft, handling they can overpower you and be bolshy, rough handling and they will retaliate. They need firm boundaries and would not be suitable for a novice, they have to feel like they are in a partnership rather than being told what to do, and can be quite unconfident in the wrong hands.
Now to a certain extent this is true of any horse, but I guess some breeds are a bit more forgiving than others.

On this other forum they say that a Welsh Sec D is not 'just a cob' and that a lot of people buy them thinking they are a normal laid back cobby type when in fact they are far from it. With my handling of Morse, I have learnt a lot in the last few months and he has suprised me on many an occasion, being
'far more thinking and intelligent' than maybe at first I gave him credit for and even though it is still early days, I would tend to agree with this statement I think.

Any thoughts?
 
fairlady said:
They need firm boundaries and would not be suitable for a novice, they have to feel like they are in a partnership rather than being told what to do, and can be quite unconfident in the wrong hands.

On this other forum they say that a Welsh Sec D is not 'just a cob' and that a lot of people buy them thinking they are a normal laid back cobby type when in fact they are far from it. With my handling of Morse, I have learnt a lot in the last few months and he has suprised me on many an occasion, being
'far more thinking and intelligent' than maybe at first I gave him credit for and even though it is still early days, I would tend to agree with this statement I think.
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I think "partnership" is a key word. Me and Daffy are a team, we compromise on almost everything. If I want to bring him in, but he wants to stop and eat, I'll let him eat as long as the rope remains slack - ie he walks and eats. He gets bored tied up and groomed, so I generally either do his favourite bits of grooming, or the bare minimum etc etc

Daffy is an extremely confident & laid back pony though, yes the odd thing he will spook at, but generally that doesn't change regardless of rider. Inhand, I get the best results because I'm the other half of the team, nobody else handles him like I do.

Ok so on Tuesday he slammed me into a steel girder because he had colic, but apparently I wasn't listening to what he was saying, although getting a bit damp with sweat was the only bloomin' symptom! :rolleyes:
 
I am almost embarassed to say, having owned TB's and Arabs, that when I bought him I thought 'oh well, not too hard, just a cob' (forgive me:D)

But there has been 'something' about him that I have not been able to put my finger on so to speak. When I read this other forum tonight, it clicked straight away, 'he is ANYTHING but 'just a cob'. I have to be 'thinking' in all my dealings with him, and take NOTHING for granted, give him an inch etc. etc. however, deal with him in the right way and he is putty in your hands, so to speak.

I have NO intention of selling him, but if I did, even when broken etc., I would never sell him to a novice, I know that already. I know my friend (YO) has had some immense problems with her Welsh Sec D Mare, and although a lovely safeish hack now, needs careful handling, and whoa-betide anyone who gets it wrong:D But is that norm of the breed??

If it is I wonder how many people go out there and buy them thinking Oh Cob, nice safe reliable type, suitable for novice/child etc., when in fact it appears they are anything but. But they do not say the same on this forum about Welsh B's and C's.
 
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I don't think it is the norm of the breed. I know of some extremely sweet and well mannered welsh D's, but I really do think it's down to the upbringing, with an element of breeding temperament in to it as well.

Daffy only barges me if he's p*ssed at me or upset. He'll barge other people, but I have his respect, so even if he wants to, he doesn't. Mum can, 9/10 times, handle him no problem, but occaisionally he'll want to do something different and that's that. She's learning to compromise though, and he certainly has more personality than many other horses I've seen over the years, possibly because I accept his behaviour as long as it isn't dangerous, and allow him to be himself.

I don't have to think much when I handle him, we know eachother, and I think nothing of my novice cousin handling him. Infact, she had her first canter on him in a showring, and can hack him off the leadrein, although I walk alongside because she really is novicey.

Mum is also really novicey..
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well I guess time will tell, Morse certainly seems to be responding to a more positive, firmer, fairer, handling rather than me pussyfooting around, keep giving him the 'benefit of the doubt' or 'making excuses for him'.

He has come on leaps and bounds or should I say We have come on leaps and bounds in the last few weeks.:D
 
Sennie is definitely a "thinker". I''ve owned "just a cob" and he would do pretty much anything I asked when I asked, unless he was feeling stubborn that day. Sennie on the other hand likes to think things out for himself first. He will do pretty much anything as long as he's been given that thinking time. For example loading. He loads easily, but has to have 30 seconds at the bottom of the ramp to think about it first. There is no point bullying him, he won't go up until he's thought about it. Then up he goes. Same every time.

He also loves to look at everything while we're out. It doesn't mean anything, he just likes to look, but it can freak people who don't know him.

He also likes to telegraph his ideas about where and how fast he thinks we should be going. I have his respect so he does always ask, and will accept a "no, we're not going to canter here". I did lend him to a teenager once however, who didn't like to insist with him and he walked all over her. He went where he wanted to go and at the speed he wanted. That's him all over, if he doesn't respect whose riding him he just takes over.

He gives the impression of being easy because he's well mannered to handle, but he's not a novice ride, you have to understand the way he's thinking.

I should also add I think welshies are stunning.
 
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I tend to associate Welsh section D's as being absolute drama queens. Lovely if they're on your side but if they aren't, watch out! I used to ride one once and I never clicked with him - I felt I spent the whole ride trying to convince him that my ideas were sound but he didn't believe me so I could never relax and have fun with him. However I've noticed that the people that have them and have convinced them that they know what they're doing, have a fantastic partnership.

In summary, not a horse for everyone, but it sounds like you and Morse have clicked, and that's the important thing :)
 
i absolutely agree with what you've read on the other forums. My first pony was a welsh D and by god i've never hit the deck so many times. Our 'ideal first pony aged about 6' turned out to be a just backed 3 year old. If you told bonnie what to do you were ejected pretty darn fast! Nobody was ever the boss of her, you really did have to earn her respect, then she'd get a bit more co-operative ;)

My 3 and a half year old welsh D responds well to having boundries set. I will be the first to put my hand up and say that i was too soft on him, purely coz i felt he deserved spoilling after his less than perfect start. He'd got a little mouthy and disrespectful of personal space. But after a groundwork session with my RI he's a transformed pony. I now have things set in my mind, and if he crosses the line he's reprimanded (usually a firm 'no' is all it takes). He was a delight before but now he's just that wee bit better ;):p They learn incredibly fast aswell.

To quote mehitabel, they are 'marmite' horses. I know so many people who hate them with a passion (including my friend who came to view kezzie with me!), or like me you just love them.
 
I have a sec d and they definatley need more handling than you think.

Kia will be bolshy if he thinks he can get away with it but if you show him you mean business then he accepts and lets you do what it is you want.

I have found tho when riding him that if he says no and you are too rough in saying yes then you come off, simple as that. I agree wioth the patient but firm handling and riding.

They can frustrate you on purpose tho so be aware!!! They are very intelligent!!!

Nikki xxx
 
I know someone who works with behavioural issues with horses and owners and a huge number of her callouts are to owners with section D's. So they're either being bought by the wrong owners or there's a problem with the breeding and temperament, or a bit of both from the sound of it. They're clearly very quick and intelligent but the ones I've met strike me as highly strung rather than having a native pony brain.
 
i would definitely say you can't boss ANY welsh around. I've always found if they love you and respect you (hence needing firm handling) they're great but if they disagree with you then its a bit more tricky. I've also found (especially with B's and D's) that if they think your being cocky they love to take you down a peg or two. i think they CAN be suitable for novices but can also try it on a lot and need a firm approach. I've always found with welshies that if you think your the worlds best rider when you can only trot you'll get shown up by a welsh quite quickly where as if your a nervous or a novice then they tend to look after you. (hence why my daughter can ride our sec B off lead rein over a small cross pole with reins like washing lines from a trot and why when i try it i sometimes get a 'sod off you can't make me' (which she finds out actually i can) I have also found welshies tend to either like you or they don't and they make it quite well known which it is. I love them because they have got such great character but definitely need a partnership type relationship. A good descriptive word for them is opinionated or as my OH says - they have a sense of humour. and yes i've found they can be a bit like arabs.
 
I don't have any experience with Welsh D's except for Joy.

I need to give her clear and consistent boundaries for her own comfort. She likes to know where she stands.

I also find that we do have to be a partnership, she won't be bossed around so giving her options and making the one I want her to choose is the best way to proceed.

When I first bought Joy I put it down to her age and a change from RS to privately owned but the more I read from others the most this seems to be a breed trait.

I personally love her quirks and as has been written numerous times before, life with a Welsh D is never boring.

There aren't many welsh d's in the RS I have been to and I wonder if how I have found Joy to be is the reason why and the need for more pliant breeds is required for the novices with the Welsh being for those with a little more experience?

Having said that I am, and will always be, a novice but a very determined and stuborn one so maybe it's down to respect on the ground rather than ability in the saddle?
 
Some very interesting replies there, and like you eventerbabe, I had to change tactics pretty quickly before he walked all over me (and thanks to a b******ing from my OH).

But, since the 'change of tactics' he has been like a different horse, in fact I joke to the other girls about which one of them has been 'drugging' him.
His whole attitude towards me has changed and I think he now sees me as someone he can trust and that he gets firm boundaries from rather than me messing around and being too 'soft and gentle, cos hes only a baby' namby pamby attitude.

I am not saying he is perfect, ha, and we certainly have a long way to go yet, OMG, but it is not a mistake I will make again, for certain, cos I know that if I do, he will be ready to teach me yet another lesson:D:D

To be honest, it's been a bit of a rocky route over the last few months for me to earn that respect, but by golly, he has earnt mine as well, and I will never think of him as 'just a cob' again:D:D
 
i think all horses are intelligent, we as owners often underestimate this, horses learn quickly and can suss people out, hence why we get the to see the bolshy side, as far as the cobs go, i thnk alot of the time just like us humans they are aware of their size, give an inch and they take a mile, these welsh ds have huge characters sit back and bond with morse, take him to the school and play, groom him and find his itchie bits, from this you will grow an amazing bond, as with any horse, no human is stronger than the smallest pony the horse ridden or on the ground has to have respect and want to do whats asked of it. having a bond with hes owner is the best way to get this to happen.
 
Yeah, we have done plenty of the 'bonding' from day one, and the bonding is there, I then let him and me down by being 'too soft' in my day to day handling of him, which then gave him the opportunity to 'continually discuss' with me as to who was gonna be the boss of our relationship:D:D

It is now working out fine, and we are getting a 'true' understanding and partnership. If he is messing and I KNOW he is genuinely not scared or frightened then 'failure' is not an option. However, if it is something new and he is genuinely not sure, it is approached with a more sympathetic, reassuring attitude, with failure still not really being an option, as I am looking to achieve 'something' if not the whole goal. i.e. picking up feet, we may not today achieve all 4, but by golly we will achieve 2. This has worked, cos we can now quite easily achieve all 4:D still somedays with a bit of discussion:D
 
We've had Jake our first Welsh D for a couple of weeks now for RDA. He's great in RDA, brilliant on the lead, will follow the leader so if they stop he'll just stop beside them, if they walk on he walks on, even without a leadrope. As to handling and on the ground, he does need a firm hand. We've also found he's a lot better in a one-to-one situation. If you bring him in on your own, tie him up and hoofpick him he's an angel, if someone else walks with you, and holds him while you hoofpick, or stands near him, he plays up. Not entirely sure why!

He's also an incredibly quick learner, the lady who we bought him from used to pull his front legs forwards every time she put the saddle on, and I believe used to just touch his legs and he'd put them forwards for her. When we first had him as soon as we touched his front legs to hoof pick him, he'd throw his foot forwards, at first we thought it was naughtiness, but then realised that he thought we wanted him to put his foot forwards! Have now thankfully got him out of that habit. He's a lovely horse, but definately needs firmer handling than others, and because he learns so quickly you can't afford to make mistakes with him!
 
mine has the wickedest sense of humour :eek:

they're fun, just great fun :D

and they do have native pony wit, i've lived to testify to that one :p
 
yeah I would agree with that teabiscuit. The bite thing (morse would nip all the time) was I HAVE to be honest, driving me up the wall.

It has stopped, thank goodness, but everynow and again he will grab my sleeve as if he is gonna bite and just give a little nudge, its as if he wants to be told off, perhaps that is just his character. The biting was never malicious, although it hurt, but I much prefer the way it is now:D, and yes he does have a great character. I love spending time with him in the field, we go over and I sit on a log chatting to him, he will always leave the others in the field to come over with me, even without any titbits:D Although, he does not stay QUITE so long:D but wherever he is in the field, and he is never that far away from me, as soon as I get up to leave, he comes over and walks to the gate with me.

However, I always make sure he knows when I am leaving, cos otherwise if he spots me in the distance, he catches up pretty quickly!!!!! ha.
 
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