Yet another hack from hell - Update!

I always ask to ride in the stubble of farmers fields but round here we have lots of disused railways that the farmers have bought and am not going to ask to ride on those!, there are very few tracks that actually go through fields round here, most of them are "core paths" and am buggered if im going to ask for their permission to ride on these!

One local farmer years ago warned us not to walk on one of these "core paths" incase he shot us by accident! nice eh?:help: They used to shoot across a highway too!:help: Some farmers are lovely and some are a pain in the arse! Bit like all humans really!

As I have already said, try your MSP and local Community Council and see if they can help.
 
I did all the polite introduction stuff when I moved to this yard. My friend and I are the ONLY riders that I know of that have used this track since 2009 and he can hardly claim we've damaged it in the past since we hadn't ridden on it since June 2010. He's fenced across some of our field gates.

Here are his reasons, in chronological order

1. Gate is chained because it's dangerous without proper hinges and council access officer told him to chain the gate.

2. He's trying to keep quad bikes out. The only quad bike in the area is his, zooming up and down the track.

3. He's keeping travellers out. There are none in the area.

4. The track is dangerous because his farm machinery has caused ruts which could cause someone to break a leg so council access officer told him to close it.

5. It's a footpath so you can only access it on foot.

6. It's not a path, even though it has waymarkers.

7. It's not officially opened yet.

Each time we've sorted his excuse out with the access officer, a new excuse is forthcoming. The latest one is that it's private property and we are not allowed on it. Sadly for him, the Scottish Access Code makes a mockery of his position. Since the gate was locked even walkers have given up, but he still mows in his paths.
 
I would go on foot and take pictures of all the gates and then go to the local paper with all your ducks in a row.

Have the pictures, the FC regulations that he is supposed to adhere to, your correspondence with the FC, BHS etc, the amount of taxpayers money he gets to provide the paths, police report from this last incident, the fact that you have been trying this for 13 months and let them have a good story for the paper. The FC will soon get their act together once it is in the papers.

And the papers will love a story about taxpayer money subsidising farmers but them not fulfilling their end of the bargain given the current economic climate.

Also offer to go round with a journalist to show them the gates and how difficult he is making it.

I wouldn't go round with my horse again but I would make it very difficult from the relevant powers to put it in the 'too hard' basket.
 
I agree with Tiga, and do your reserach into which journalist you approach. Some make more impact than others. What's your local paper? The Press & Journal seem to be quite good at picking things up like this, but it's Perth based I think.

I think it's shocking! He blatantly just wanted his greedy hands on the money, but without the hassle of allowing people to use it. Sorry, it doesn't work that way. I'm glad you are all safe. Has he recieved the grant? And if so, can he have it revoked if doesn't comply with the conditions imposed?

If these are conditions set by the FC Scotland I would be getting myself to Silvan House to discuss it with whoever is responsible for ensuring the conditions of the grant are adhered to. If you dont get a timely response from him, escalate it, and keep going till you reach the CEO. Also get talking to the Scottish Government, and escalate it to Stewart Stevenson if needed. Make sure you do it all in writing, and back it up with pestering phone calls to make sure they are actually dealing with it.

I know they probably don't have the resources to actually ensure he complies to the conditions set, but really, if that is the case, then they shouldn't be issuing a grant...simple as that.
 
Thats whats so crazy about these grants and different licences etc.

They say you need them or give a grant and then have nobody to chase up
that its actually being used as it should be??????????

Go on Foot, take lots of pictures, go back to FC and BHS and say if
they don't take action you will by going to the local Newspapers and that
you are prepared to state that you have contacted them endlessly to no avail.
 
I also agree with Flipo's Mum. I do understand that Scottish law for rights of way is different from here, but personally I would not be very happy if people rode over our ground. Sorry ............
 
sjp1 said:
I also agree with Flipo's Mum. I do understand that Scottish law for rights of way is different from here, but personally I would not be very happy if people rode over our ground. Sorry ............
Click to expand...

Yes, but if you took the cash that was for the upkeep of paths for people to use your land whether it be on foot or horse, then surely you should "allow" said riders/walkers to do so?
 
I am afraid i would be taking the kissing gate off their hinges and taking them away. He has NO RIGHT to restrict access to the land, its for public use.

I would take pictures of all the gate and send them to BHS, local council and then if nothing is done my local papaer would be getting told about it and about the attack on me and my friend.
 
Scotland has the right to roam and landowners can complain all they want but it won't change the law. And this farmer has no right to behave in such a manner. The FC aren't particularly effective, but i have a friend who works for them and can see if he can find out who you should contact? You shouldn't have to put up with such abuse. I'd pursue the breach of the peace charge to the max and i think the police were very remiss not to attend. Sounds like you were being threatened and under scots law it's a breach of the peace if you feel threatened by the verbal or physical behaviour of someone else. I hope you find a resolution, what an unpleasant experience :(
 
I too hope you find a way forward, but really hope you don;t put yourself at risk again. Fingers crossed for you, please keep us updated :wink:
 
There is no 'right to roam' in Scotland. There is a right of responsible access. If a rider is acting responsibly, by respecting the rights of the landowner to make a living from the land without damage to his livelihood, without intrusion on his privacy, and ensuring that any livestock are not disturbed when vulnerable such as at lambing time, then that rider should be allowed access.

Farmers are no different to anyone else in that they expect to be treated with respect. If there are people riding/walking/cycling/using quads through or over their land with apparent disregard for his rights, he will be upset.

On the other hand, if he has been given an opportunity to explain his concerns, and to advise users of his land on what he sees as safe, responsible access, perhaps with temporary restrictions (with options) at certain times, he will be more likely to comply with the law rather than break it as he seems to be doing.

Perhaps if you and your friend sought a meeting with him, with a responsible witness present, you could all begin to sort this out without resorting to the police; although you were right to call the police on that occasion.

No-one likes to be treated the way you have, and he should not have behaved that way, but there will be a way to progress without further confrontation.
 
AengusOg, we thought the same at one point. We've tried speaking to him politely and in a very friendly manner, promised him we'd keep an eye on his escaping sheep, phone him if there were too many out for us to put. back, let him know of any signs of inteference with gates and fences, checked he was ok when we saw his quad bike half way in a fence, showed him where our electric fencing had been cut deiberately, so that he knew to keep a close eye on his fences and livestock incase whoever it was came back.

We discussed with him the possibility of having a key to his padlock and making sure that when we went in we locked the gate behind us and when we went back out we locked it again. His only objection was that the council wouldn't let him. This wasn't true.

The track is only useable by horses for about 10 weeks a year, if that, because it's reclaimed bog. We do not intend to damage the path, ride off the path, enter any of his fields or approach his farmyard. Last year, when we discovered part of the path was too soft we turned back straight away and let him know that that's what we had done so he was't worried about any damage. We even walked it with him to show him where we had turned back.

We have bent over backwards to keep things friendly, even after he confronted us last year then chased us with his tractor. He's been exactly the same with his neighbours, fencing across their gateways, digging ditches across them and breaking their field drains which has turned one corner of our field into a bog and generally being verbally abusive. Faced with this, I don't see how a discussion will help and tbh I don't know that I could do that after having my disability mocked by his wife and then her threats to inform the benefits people that I was riding a horse while claiming disaility benefit. I'm doing nothing wrong and threats to interfere with my private life have NOT gone down very well.

Some of the suggestions that you have all given me have been tried, to no avail, but other suggestions look promising. He has been given taxpayers' money to create this woodland on condition that the public can use it and he is reneging on that agreement. Either the condtions should be enforced or his grant sold be withdrawn in it's entirety. Additionally, one of the conditions attached to his planning consent for cofts is that he provide a hard-surfaced path (gravel) the length of the route. Last night we wandered up to another area which has the same conditions attached and in the space of 6 weeks a gravelled path has been created which is huge and goes through mature pine forest and over heathland. Horse friendly gates have been installed and it's magnificent. Our farmer has had years and done nothing.
 
Hmmmm. Sounds as if you have put up with enough of this man's rotten behaviour.

Anyone who is a gold member of the BHS can get free legal advice on matters such as these.
 
Yes access can be a touchy subject for some landowners. However, in Scotland the land access bill was passed 2 or 3 years ago and it is quite a detailed document but the key words are reasonable and responsible and these two words apply to landowners and land users. In my understanding that does mean that the land users have to be mindfull of what crops or livestock are in the fields and avoid going through them or at the very least skirt round them. Landowners for their part should not padlock gates on tracks like some have been doing since the enactment of the bill. Common sense needs to be employed by both land user and landowner and sometimes people do not employ this very important skill. Probably because i am quite a large man who spent most of his younger years in the armed services i must say i have only encountered an obstinate not very pleasant landowner who attempted to bully me on one occasion and after stepping down from the horse and explaining that when you shout at people they tend not to listen he calmed down. After being informed of the need to speak in quieter tones he agreed that as long as i was keeping to established tracks i was well within my rights. So the moral of this incident for me and him was if you speak to people in a respectful and responsible manner more often than not you find compromise. However i have noticed that some men do have a problem in talking to female horse riders in a responsible and respectful manner and tend to shout or whizz past in cars causing upset it is either ignorance, lack of education or at the very worst bullying. However, there are also land users who have no respect for the land they are accessing and they are equally as ignorant and i would expect the landowner to bring the full weight of the law down on them rather than take it out on everyone else, we do not employ summary justice in this country there are processes and they apply to landowner and land user.
 
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