Issues with having feet done... Any suggestions?

popularfurball

popularfurball

Learning all the time
Jul 18, 2005
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Snow has finally gone, and trimmer came out yesterday :D

Lovely lady, very calm and patient with Silver - no shouting or hitting her, just gave her time to settle down.

However, Silver was just the same - if not worse than with the farrier. Farrier tends to shout at her and then she stands quiet as a mouse and doesnt put a foot wrong. By the end (took an hour to do four feet, but we got them done :D), I had a squashed hand, been squashed against wall mutiple times, trimmer had been trampled etc etc.... Silver kept spinning round and going at her stable door and ramming it trying to get in. When she was done and I opened the door she didnt even wait for it to be open and barged through it and ran and hid. She was doing her white wild eyes in panic....

I dont understand how to manage this. The more we practice the worse she seems to be getting (with me), and thought someone with a quieter approach would really help her - but alas no she was still frightened.

I am relustant to trim her myself gradually as I dont have the skills to do it, and I couldnt trust myself to identify problems with so little knowledge.

She had refused point blank to pick her feet up for a week prior to yesterday - which culminated in me being bitten on Weds night. I have tried tying her up, having her loose, being in a bigger outdoor space and on a lunge... Yet when she hadnt been touched for a few months, she picked them all up relatively easily...
 
Poor pony and poor you :( Sounds like she's doing it out of fear rather than nastiness, she's obviously had a bad experience.

Just a thought, Debbie Glennan who is an Intelligent Horsemanship (Kelly Marks) trainer is now based in Bakewell, she's also training to be a trimmer with the same organisation yours belongs to. She's not that far away and is a superb horseperson, might be worth contacting her to see if she can help?

She is currently studying to become a barefoot trimmer so foot related issues are a speciality as the actual trim can be included into the session.
Click to expand...

You might be able to kill two birds with one stone. Her contact details are at http://www.intelligenthorsemanship.co.uk/content/view/47/97/#midlands

Ignore the fact it says Newark, the phone no is a Bakewell one ;)
 
I don't want to tell you to suck eggs but have you tried approach and retreat with her?

If she really is that worried then to start with the approach can be as simple as brushing/touching all the way down her legs. The important part is the retreat. Retreat when she is standing still, behaving stay with her/do not retreat even if she's scared if she moves or starts being silly. It doesn't mean progress just 'stay with her' so if you hand is on her hock and she's silly just keep your hand (or try to) on or near her hock/leg then when she stops even for a split second then take your hand away for the release. If you don't want to use your hand use a stick/crop whatever to touch her legs, if th eproblem is picking up then use a long lead rope to pick her feet up this will allow you to keep with her when she is silly without you getting kicked/hurt, and also allow you to release fairly quickly when she behaves. It might take you a while but repetition is the key. If you repeated it and got good results for 50 times over a week you'd be well on your way to being much better.

Hope that makes sense by the way
 
When I do it with her, she isn't look wild eyed and frightened like she is with the farrier - but gets aggressive about the whole thing (which I know can be defensive over insecurity/worry/fear).

I have found the best way to do her feet is in an open space on a lunge line.

I got OH to video the whole thing in the summer when someone originally suggested working on a similar basis to this. On this particular day she decided to be good :rolleyes:.



She just gets in the way with me, refuses to let me change sides, bites my bum and kicks out with back legs. She picks her back foot up once her front foot has gone down, but if you touch it she swings leg out.

We've worked through so much - the last bigger scared issues she has are the weigh tape, the farrier and the hose!
 
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ETA I forgot to add I can groom all her legs without a problem, she isnt comfortable being groomed anyway, but her bad area is her neck - tummy and legs no problem!
Its only when i try and pick up the fun begins...

I have emailed her, thanks Yann :)
 
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She totally moves you about when you're trying to get round to her other front doesn't she! (See I'm learning...you should try to get her to move round you - no idea how you would go about that though!!!:eek:)
Little madam...I don't think Flip could lift his back leg that far up! Has she kicked in the past - you are keeping a safe distance!! Doesn't look scared though, just like there's something irritating her (you?!!):p

Think I might have to start videoing progress aswell, getting a bit lenient with Mr Flip and need to keep at it.
 
She's lovely isn't she :) It's difficult when there's a bit of trauma going on, but a couple of things strike me watching the video. The first is that she's moving you around at will rather than the other way round, if you can work on that and having her stand until asked otherwise then the leg handling may well improve by itself. The other thing, and I know it's easy to say, is that she's getting a reward by threatening you with her hind. You need to try and brazen it out, not flinch or react, and maybe even ask for a bit of hindquarter yield if she does it, as much as anything that will put her feet back on the ground.

I don't know if you've already worked through this but I'd also not ask for a big lift and hold straight off, start with incremental lifts, releasing when you feel her relax and accept them, and then build up the length of time.

I helped a friend with a little pony that was terrified of the farrier and having his feet done, what really worked with him was using a clicker. If she bites and can be muggy then you need to be super disciplined about not rewarding unless you've asked for and got something though.
 
I was thinking about clicker training last night!!!! I wasnt sure if I could only clicker train for feet though? Although I would probably do it for "stand" as well as she has issues with stand.

I now hindquarter yield when she threatens with her back legs, and this is working well. She threatens like this when grooming but actually just ignore it - she doesnt actually kick very often. I do make sure I keep my hand on her to maintain the pressure but am stepping away which I shouldn't.

In terms of the big lift, sounds silly, but didnt know if she might have had a tall person before me??? Lol. She lifts them up so high, but very difficult to encourage to put down and hold lower.

I muzzled her this morning (stop bum bites) and we did one foot without too much of a palava. I rewarded her and left it at that.
 
You're definitely on the right track. Yes, you can just clicker train just for feet, the key thing is to get the horse connecting the click with the action and the reward, which is why you usually start with a touching a target first.

Just to clarify, by big lift I meant asking for the full leg up all at once, rather than asking for a **** of the hoof to begin with and building up gradually from there. If she picks them up high by choice that's slightly different :)
 
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