Icelandics - tolt aids?
- Thread starter Hammie
- Start date
C
CER1389
Guest
*cue CER1389 sitting on her chair pretending it's a icelandic, trying to make it tolt*
Tolt is all about the horse coming through from behind, moving forward and coming 'up' infront. So it starts with collection. I'm going to explain the very exaggerated aids, the ones for learning it, or possibly teaching a horse to tolt. I liken it to teaching a rider to canter. When they first learn they are taught it in an exaggerated manner, then, as they progress, their aids are far more subtle.
Rider sits up nice and tall, pushs weight down into heels, closes thigh around and holds in with seat bone and abdominal muscles. Horse begins to slow its walk. Rider shortens reins, sits even deeper, raises hands. Horse starts to bring it's front end up. Rider closes thighs around and squeeze (with thigh, not lower leg). Horse tolts. Often the rider will be carrying a schooling whip, and a slight flick is given, to get the back end to come through.
This aid is very much dependent on the horse in question, however in tolt the riders lower leg rarely touches the horses side (infact this is common in all icelandic riding, the lower leg rarely touches) and it is all cued from seat aids. The shortened reins and raised hands are more to encourage the front end up, never to hold it up.
Showing the riders legs not touching the horses side - and I think it shows how much his seat is being used. If you look at his amusing facial expression, it is because he is making a "kissing" noise. A lot of icelandics are trained to this sound being their cue to tolt.
With a natural tolter, it can be held from the seat so much so that there is a "loose rein tolt" class. In which the riders have to tolt "showing no contact between riders hands and horses mouth" for this, most riders will put one hand on the buckle of the reins, and drop the other hand. Although this looks effortless, it is all held from the seat still.
Although (the dun) looks effortless, I guarentee it's not. I have been lucky enough to ride this horse, and attempt loose rein tolt on him. He naturally tolts in hand, not trots, however after loose rein tolting him for about 10 seconds I had to stop, and when I dismounted it felt like I had done 90 sit ups! I found I had abdominal muscles I never knew existed!
*CER1389 runs for cover under desk, donning a tin hat for protection*
Tolt is all about the horse coming through from behind, moving forward and coming 'up' infront. So it starts with collection. I'm going to explain the very exaggerated aids, the ones for learning it, or possibly teaching a horse to tolt. I liken it to teaching a rider to canter. When they first learn they are taught it in an exaggerated manner, then, as they progress, their aids are far more subtle.
Rider sits up nice and tall, pushs weight down into heels, closes thigh around and holds in with seat bone and abdominal muscles. Horse begins to slow its walk. Rider shortens reins, sits even deeper, raises hands. Horse starts to bring it's front end up. Rider closes thighs around and squeeze (with thigh, not lower leg). Horse tolts. Often the rider will be carrying a schooling whip, and a slight flick is given, to get the back end to come through.
This aid is very much dependent on the horse in question, however in tolt the riders lower leg rarely touches the horses side (infact this is common in all icelandic riding, the lower leg rarely touches) and it is all cued from seat aids. The shortened reins and raised hands are more to encourage the front end up, never to hold it up.
Showing the riders legs not touching the horses side - and I think it shows how much his seat is being used. If you look at his amusing facial expression, it is because he is making a "kissing" noise. A lot of icelandics are trained to this sound being their cue to tolt.
With a natural tolter, it can be held from the seat so much so that there is a "loose rein tolt" class. In which the riders have to tolt "showing no contact between riders hands and horses mouth" for this, most riders will put one hand on the buckle of the reins, and drop the other hand. Although this looks effortless, it is all held from the seat still.
Although (the dun) looks effortless, I guarentee it's not. I have been lucky enough to ride this horse, and attempt loose rein tolt on him. He naturally tolts in hand, not trots, however after loose rein tolting him for about 10 seconds I had to stop, and when I dismounted it felt like I had done 90 sit ups! I found I had abdominal muscles I never knew existed!
*CER1389 runs for cover under desk, donning a tin hat for protection*
out of interest (sorry to hijack thread)
but can icelandics do normal things like trot and canter
but can icelandics do normal things like trot and canter
I
*IcyRider*
Guest
out of interest (sorry to hijack thread)
but can icelandics do normal things like trot and canter
hehe yes
However canter and gallop are counted as the same thing.Hence how you get 4 and 5 gaited Icys 4 gaited-walk,trot,tolt and canter/gallop and the same for a 5 gaited just with pace
Although saying this you can get some weird mixtures of all of them.Tolt and pace can get muddled together and things.Thinking about it, its kinda complex!
All Icelandics are different, I have never met two the same. You get trotty tölters, and tölty trotters and pacy tölters and everything in between.
I have met some who really are not interested in tölt and are strongly 3 gaited (walk, trot, canter/gallop)
We had one who was one gaited, he paced, he paced at all speeds, but nothing but pace. He was very comfy though.
Doing a loose rein tölt does take a lot of skill, but if you teach the horse from day one to listen to your seat aids it comes very easily.
If you teach them to go on the "haul them in and wind them up" school of thought, popular in the 80's and earlier, you will run into trouble.
Joining Cer1389 under the table with extra sand bags
I have met some who really are not interested in tölt and are strongly 3 gaited (walk, trot, canter/gallop)
We had one who was one gaited, he paced, he paced at all speeds, but nothing but pace. He was very comfy though.
Doing a loose rein tölt does take a lot of skill, but if you teach the horse from day one to listen to your seat aids it comes very easily.
If you teach them to go on the "haul them in and wind them up" school of thought, popular in the 80's and earlier, you will run into trouble.
Joining Cer1389 under the table with extra sand bags
I
*IcyRider*
Guest
Do you want me to bring the rations?Ive got lots of choky left over from Xmas should keep us going a while
pls dont jump me but arent they strange looking, not in a evil way and im not being horrible either, they have small heads and big thick necks, the fist pic, it looks like hes all legs. pretty little heads tho
I
*IcyRider*
Guest
The horse in the first pic is a stallion so of course he's going to be abit bigger on the neck
I dont think they look any different to any other native breed.Of course you get different types,short and stocky,fine and legy etc...Just like any other breed.Just with Icelandic's you get a much bigger colour range.
Ive owned both types and have to say i like the old type of short stocky and a leg in each corner!
I dont think they look any different to any other native breed.Of course you get different types,short and stocky,fine and legy etc...Just like any other breed.Just with Icelandic's you get a much bigger colour range.
Ive owned both types and have to say i like the old type of short stocky and a leg in each corner!
I
*IcyRider*
Guest
im no expert, but isnt that just the way he is carrying himself?
Yep
I think of you looked at a picture of him showing off his conformation you'd be suprised.
I wish I could find the picture of different conformations applying to different gaited Icelandics.
Some of the pacier horses with speed can look like a cheese wedge.
Not what I was looking for hang on, I'll find it yet but this is interesting...
http://iceryder.blogspot.com/2008/07/icelandic-horse-neck-conformation.html
http://leeziegler.com/howtoart.html
Some of the pacier horses with speed can look like a cheese wedge.
Not what I was looking for hang on, I'll find it yet but this is interesting...
http://iceryder.blogspot.com/2008/07/icelandic-horse-neck-conformation.html
http://leeziegler.com/howtoart.html
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he looks very large chested and a little bum, if you know *** i mean. to be honest i never even heard of the breed till i came on here so dont no anything about them.
Until about the 1960's.. majority of the Icelandic's had to live out side all year round and the winters were cold and harsh.
Their conformation naturally came about so they could best handle the winters.
And Until then... Icelanders needed working horses to get them to point A to point B and be very hardy.
Their instestines are also quite a bit different than other equines,, they are set up to be able to eat marginal foods, many other equines couldn't live off of.
This is why many look like they do.
I have been around Nordic breeds so many years.. I honestly think long necked and legged horses look strange.
I don't always ride with a bit, but this day I did. Dyfra is 5 gaited, tending towards the Pace. If you know how, it is easy to clean up all her gaits. I prefer her body type...but I would like her legs to be a little thicker.
Now a days you will see that the Icelanders are trying to refine the Icelandic more, so you get some that are really odd looking. As per the Eidfaxi, I am not impressed at all the direction they are wanting to go with these horses. Seen it happen to, to many breeds here in the US. Very sad.
Their conformation naturally came about so they could best handle the winters.
And Until then... Icelanders needed working horses to get them to point A to point B and be very hardy.
Their instestines are also quite a bit different than other equines,, they are set up to be able to eat marginal foods, many other equines couldn't live off of.
This is why many look like they do.
I have been around Nordic breeds so many years.. I honestly think long necked and legged horses look strange.
I don't always ride with a bit, but this day I did. Dyfra is 5 gaited, tending towards the Pace. If you know how, it is easy to clean up all her gaits. I prefer her body type...but I would like her legs to be a little thicker.
Now a days you will see that the Icelanders are trying to refine the Icelandic more, so you get some that are really odd looking. As per the Eidfaxi, I am not impressed at all the direction they are wanting to go with these horses. Seen it happen to, to many breeds here in the US. Very sad.
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I don't put much stock in Lee's method for Icelandics. I have done this to most of the Icelandic's I have owned and she didn't get close.
Take Dyfra for Example.. she is very strong in pace..could be a flying Pacer if I let her. Her body is very supple thank goodness...so it is easy to clean the pace out of her other gaits.
When I had Lee use that method..awhile back.. she told me that Dyfra would be trotty and not be able to Pace.
Guess Dyfra didn't read her view on things.
It might work well with other breeds but not the Icelandic's I have had.
Fascinating! I'm in the market for one of these guys so I'll keep that in mind.
Think I may try it on my TWH.
Think I may try it on my TWH.
Having listened to people who know more than me and have watched me ride, or know my horse, I understand him to be described as "a natural tolter" or "lateral" in his movements. Recently, through schooling, Im also getting a much freer and forward going trot and FINALLY, Im getting the gait I want and when I want it (or even switching between the two) most of the time. Hurrah - slow learner me!!
The owner of my last yard but one used to say Icelandics "look funny" and "why are their tails set on so low?", but there you go, we all have our favourite horses and enormous cobs was his thing.
The owner of my last yard but one used to say Icelandics "look funny" and "why are their tails set on so low?", but there you go, we all have our favourite horses and enormous cobs was his thing.
C
CER1389
Guest
The most accurate description of icelandics I heard were:
16hh horses on 13hh legs
and
Quad bikes with 4 legs
16hh horses on 13hh legs
and
Quad bikes with 4 legs
newrider.com