As an observer at a dressage comp..

Clava

Clava

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Apr 24, 2008
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On the South Downs, Hampshire
Yesterday I went to watch a few classes at a dressage competition near me (I had entered but Belle had lost a shoe) and I found it very interesting and slightly shocking. So many riders seemed heavy handed, constantly kicking at their horses and unbalanced, the light and gentle riders shone in comparason but there were so few of these - why do you think this is? Is the need for an outline causing more people to force it or is it taught like that, or are these riders actually making the best of what they have and I am being too critical?

The judge was over an hour late so the warm up area was packed allowing observers to see and compare lots of riders at once.

What are your thoughts on watching local dressage competitions.?
 
To be honest, whether it be at local or national level, I still get shocked by what I see going on in a dressage arena.
It's what makes it so lovely when you do see a light, soft rider on a free moving horse in a correct outline.

As for why it is: peoples lack of education, and lack of patience to get the horse working correctly.

It's a shame as well. I've ridden horses that are onthe forehand and pulled in, and having done a lot of schooling recently to get my land working frm behind and into my hand (rather than just tootling along) its an amazing feeling to have the horse working so soft and supple in its back .... its a shame more people can't get that/do that feeling
 
I've had similar experiences in the past. It can only be how people are taught, and some of the stuff that goes on at the higher end of the discipline doesn't do anything to disabuse them of it. I would agree with the people who say that modern competitive dressage has moved a long way from its original principles even if the stated rules and objectives still say the same things.
 
Yann said:
I've had similar experiences in the past. It can only be how people are taught, and some of the stuff that goes on at the higher end of the discipline doesn't do anything to disabuse them of it. I would agree with the people who say that modern competitive dressage has moved a long way from its original principles even if the stated rules and objectives still say the same things.
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If it is how they are taught, why is our standard of instruction so low or is it the poor interpretation of the pupil?
 
I agree that it can be affected by methods of teaching. My first RI was of the opinion that I should be encouraging Tyler into an outline with lots of transitions and simple instructions. It took a while but we got there.

I tried a different and apparently better known RI who wanted to 'kick, kick, kick' and pull the reins n, almost forcing T into an outline. I could tell the T was uncomfortable and so was I.

It is a shame that modern day riding has deviated from what is started out as.
 
I suspect it's how people are taught and the pressure to move on fast. I've had KICK KICK KICK and SHORTEN THOSE REINS (to the point of the poor horse having their chin on their chests) drummed into me so many times it's unreal. I've walked out of somany riding lessons because of it and I think it's the main reason I didn't look for more lessons after Dryad closed.

I honestly wouldn't know how to ask for a proper outline. I can get a horse tracking up easily enough but the only time it's ever come totally together is a total fluke! :D
 
When I shared a livery horse at a riding school I decided it was time I learned how to get him working properly and had some lessons with the YO. They were truly awful and consisted of riding the poor old horse round and round in circles on a strong contact and strong leg. I found it exhausting and depressing and eventually decided I was just going to hack him instead. I don't think my experience was that untypical, people are taught to see saw the reins and put spurs on at the drop of a hat. I'm not quite sure how you're supposed to get from that strong contact to true self carriage:confused:

Why do you think draw reins are so popular? :(
 
I think there is 2 sides to this.

I am with the fact it is shocking. I don't like a lot of what I see, and I think too much emphasis is put on shape, without the basics being in place first. A lot of the time, 'outline' comes from the front end backwards, meaning there is a lack of 'throughness' and impulsion, rather than the correctly working from the back end forwards which naturally brings the back in and the neck round. Quick fixes, and lack of understanding of the effects of the wrong type of riding on the horse is often the cause, imo.

However there is the other side of things: at local unaffiliated level there are often an awful lot of riders and horses who don't compete on a regular basis. The riders become tense. The horses can be tense due to new place, new atmosphere, or because they are feeding off the rider's nervousness.
This can turn a horse and rider that work lovely together at home in a horrible picture at a competition. Some horses lack confidence in moving forwards, and the riders tense response is to kick kick kick with flapping legs, whilst holding with the hands. Other horses are more inclined to rush, which often causes the rider to instinctively hold the horse, tipping them onto the forehand, which usually exacerbates the problem: but then again, you need a clear calm head to think about how to ride through the problems that you usually don't encounter and the nerves (even those who don't feel them all that much) can block the thought processes...

I have a horse prone the the latter - rushing and leaning into me. I'm not a nervous rider but I'm sure I'm not as chilled and relaxed as I would be outside of a competition atmosphere. I have to say that despite my horse working lightly and correctly at home, our first several competitions made us look horrendous - he is a very tense horse, and in the warm up arena would just get thoroughly wound up, getting stronger and stronger and faster and faster. I admit I instinctively held him which made him look overbent, with a neck like rock, he stopped working 'through' even though his hind end was active, and he was somewhat hollow too(I did try not to hold in those earlier comps, but that resulted in a wall of death :eek:). We probably looked much like the majority of riders Clava describes ;)

Now that we are a little more experienced, I've devised a warm up plan we stick to. It's a very calm, relaxed approach and although very gradual, because he listens better and I stay more focused as I know just what I'm doing so no need to worry, usually takes a lot less time than just going to the warm up arena and having to hooley around it in an attempt to quiet the horse. But it did take me a while to work this all out and get it sorted in a way that works for us...and until then, we looked HORRIBLE :eek: :eek:

So yes - lots of things that are appauling, unacceptable, and I wouldn't agree with, ever! BUT particularly at lower novice levels, at local comps, we are seeing inexperienced combinations and do probably seeing them at their worst - which doesn't excuse it, but means we just have to hope that it won't be all that long till they figure out a way to settle themselves and their horses ;)
As a result it's very difficult to judge one way or another I think...But I do agree it's rarely a pretty sight at the majority!
 
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It's a pity. I went expecting to be a little inspired and by the girl who won on a fabulous highland in Novice 20 I was:) (soft, round and made all the transitions look easy, this horse originally came wild off the hill and now is mostly a happy hacker and is driven - I found out later from the owner).

Peaches - I know what you mean about tension and a horse that gets faster (Belle all over:p), but even with nerves on the horses part and the riders so much of the basics of balance seemed to be missing. i know these riders are not necessarily regular competitors but they must be getting their ideas of how to behave from somewhere. An unschooled horse is fine to see as long as it is ridden nicely and both are having a go, it is when they are not being ridden nicely that I find it difficult.
 
Wholeheartedly agree. I compete, but I get into the zone when I'm riding and pay little attention to everyone else. I can't go to a show just to watch, it's too depressing. I get horribly fed up with the general standard of riding in this country. I'm no wonder-rider, but I am very aware of my faults and try to be very kind to my horse. Some people's riding falls little short of abuse.
 
I think I pushed Edward on (with legs) too much in my first dressage comp. Think this is because:

Firstly, I'm a novice and still have so much to learn:eek:
Secondly, he is used to spurs, which I dont ride in, so he does need a little leg/schooling whip. I was so worried he'd be lazy, think I over did it with the legs.

My final comment was "becareful not to push him out of his natural rythm".

An experienced friend agreed that I over did with my legs a little. However, I really dont think that I did anything to upset Ed (I hope).

During my next lessons, I'm going to work on trying to lighten my aids!
 
It is generally very depressing watching dressage. The odd rider who rides well and not in the awfull "fashionable" way really stand out. You have to wonder if they always ride in this awful way, and if they do, how do they have the energy to ride? Also, it shows how forgiving horses can be, although they should not be put in this position.

It is no wonder some horses don't like going near anything remembling an arena/school. The last time I went I was pleased to see a very ordinary cob who was ridden well beating horses that must have been worth 10k at least.

As for the constant kicking, this should be marked down. A horse that is trained should move in the same gait/rythem until asked to change. Surely the constant kick, kick is showing that this is not happening and should be marked accordingly. And what happened to invisable aids, sometimes you wonder who is working harder, the rider or the horse.
 
kathyt1 said:
As for the constant kicking, this should be marked down. A horse that is trained should move in the same gait/rythem until asked to change. Surely the constant kick, kick is showing that this is not happening and should be marked accordingly. And what happened to invisable aids, sometimes you wonder who is working harder, the rider or the horse.
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Well, a horse that is trained should move in the same gait until asked to change as long as the rider is balanced. I think we are being a little unfair to our prelim and even novice level comrades in expecting them to have fully devloped and independent seats which will allow the rider to balance and give the horse the greatest chance of retaining its own balance and move forward. Also, prelim and novice riders do not have the feel necessary to know EARLY ENOUGH that their horse is becoming unbalanced to apply the aids fast enough that the horse does not lose rhythm or fall on the forehand. A "beginning" dressage rider lacks the toolkit to deal with some of these issues so resorts to, especially in a nervous situation like a competition, the only solution he/she has - applying the leg repeatedly.

I admit, heavy hands and a driving leg in an effort to achieve an "outline" are wrong and should be frowned upon. But, on the point mentioned by kathyt above, riders at this early stage are not "educated" enough to have the finesse and balance to be able to apply "invisible" aids and should not be penalised as such.
 
Not all horses are naurally good at dressage, but many of us novicey riders want to have a go at a low-level test or two. So we have to give a bit of extra encouagement to our reluctant mounts. Jack is actually rather good at dressage - when he wants to be. He is also incredibly lazy. He will drop off the outline very quickly if you don't keep reminding him, which means constant squeezing with the seat, and regular jiggles on the reins. In practise sessions the end result is rather nice. In my first test, the warm up was good, but the minute we entered the arena, the combination of his nosiness and my nerves meant - nose in the air, hollow back etc :rolleyes:.
 
Maybe these problems are because riders are so keen to get out and compete they go before the basics are really established and there is no self carriage: at whatever level they compete at. Also there is very little education, as a lot of owners get out and 'go for it'.
Feel is the basis of education for the rider and there are sadly few places to go and get the feel and then go home and train the horse with knowledge. Not so easy to train the 'blind leading the blind...' In this country there are few instructors with schoolmasters who will allow riders to gain experience.
Competition is not an end in itself - at least not for the dedicated rider. It used to be the show case for the trained horse and rider.
 
I certainly wasn't looking for or expected invisible aids - and I didn't really mean that the horses were more unbalanced than I expected but the riders were. During a year of dressage lessons I've never been advised to see saw on the bit for an outline, we work on it coming naturally with the horse wanting to reach into contact. Just seeing so many riders together doing things that looked so uncomforatble shocked me a little. I too am full of faults and certainly do not expect prelim and novice riders to all be wonderful, but I did expect less aggression and harshness, but I am very naive.:eek:
 
POPPY1 said:
I think I pushed Edward on (with legs) too much in my first dressage comp. Think this is because:

Firstly, I'm a novice and still have so much to learn:eek:
Secondly, he is used to spurs, which I dont ride in, so he does need a little leg/schooling whip. I was so worried he'd be lazy, think I over did it with the legs.

My final comment was "becareful not to push him out of his natural rythm".

An experienced friend agreed that I over did with my legs a little. However, I really dont think that I did anything to upset Ed (I hope).

During my next lessons, I'm going to work on trying to lighten my aids!
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im sure you wont have upset him! :) and you'll have a better idea next time of what his natural rhythm feels like. plus i think its better to have your horse moving forward actively and tracking up rather than him be inactive and not moving forwards off your leg properly

i saw some really bad riding at the last competition i went too, see sawing on the reins to get their horses overbent and looking "pretty" :eek:
 
I admit, heavy hands and a driving leg in an effort to achieve an "outline" are wrong and should be frowned upon. But, on the point mentioned by kathyt above, riders at this early stage are not "educated" enough to have the finesse and balance to be able to apply "invisible" aids and should not be penalised as such.
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At the lower levels "outline" as such is not much of a requirement. As for finesse, balance and "invisable" aids I would teach this at the beginning and fully expect to achieve this with my pupils. Why teach somebody wrongly then go back and teach them correctly :confused: Much easier to teach correctly from the beginning. As for riders not being penalised, maybe they should be. Perhaps then teaching will improve and the horse won't suffer as a result.
 
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