Torn Laminae anyone?

E

evie's mummy

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Jul 13, 2006
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Friends horse has just been diagnosed with the above. I thought this only happened with Laminitis but apparently this is not related. Does anyone have any experience of this and also what is expected in terms of recovery?
Thanks!!!
 
Can't say this is something I've heard of, could you explain a bit further? What are the symptoms? If it's not diet related, then surely it would amount to mechanical laminitis, ie a wall separation caused by physical force. Are the feet long in the toe or flared?
 
Yann - the horse just came in from the field slightly lame, no sign of any injury. Lameness got worse and Vet felt sure abscess was likely to erupt. After several days horse taken into clinic for x rays , nerve blocks etc. I think at first they were expecting perhaps pedal bone fracture or navicular but apparently no tests confirmed this. I have not got full details on how today they're suddenly saying 'torn laminae'. I would have thought this would have been seen on first x rays? The horse is new to my friend, she's only had him 6 weeks. Our Farrier did want to change the shape of his feet slightly but to my knowledge they weren't in any bad form. Seems a bit of a mystery to me:confused:
 
If there's serious wall separation then I would imagine it would show up in the hoof wall to some extent, have to say I'm still a bit mystified. Did the horse come off grass once the vet got involved? Diet related soreness in the feet without full blown laminitis symptoms has been quite common this year, and seems to be quite easily fixed by keeping off pasture for a few days. Poor foot shape can also cause non specific lameness, especially badly underrun heels.
 
I've never heard of a torn lamina nor can think of how you would diagnose it. And a torn lamina becomes lamintis by definintion!

The treatment and recovery will be excatly the same as actue laminitis. Frog supports, reduced diet, box rest, ACP and painkillers etc.
 
Torn laminae means lamintis! The laminae inflame and then tear causeing the pain which causes the lameness.

There are many causes of lami, grass is the cause of very few cases. Obesity, poor feeding, lack of exercise, hard ground, stress, poor feet all rank above grass as the cause.

There is a whole spectrum of lami from slight footyness to founder.

For many people there is a stigma attatched to having a horse with lami as it is totaly avoidable and a sign that something has been neglected. Could it be that your friend is using 'torn laminae" as a euphimism for lami :eek:
 
Alfies-slave said:
For many people there is a stigma attatched to having a horse with lami as it is totaly avoidable and a sign that something has been neglected.
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i hope that is a tongue in cheek comment, if not it's absolutely uncalled for :mad: i know many horses who've developed laminitis and there was nothing their owners could have done to prevent it. So my fellow SWPCA member who lost his 2 cobs to laminitis triggered by thier annual vaccines could have prevented it could he?!
 
Yes, many people look down their noses at horse keepers whose horses founder. They believe that the horsekeepers don't know what they are doing.

Only last week I overheard your typical snotty pony club mummies "no, so and so isn't here, pony founderd, not suprised, it was as fat as a pig last time I saw it" etc, etc!

In many cases they are right. However there are times when it is out of the owners control.
 
Yep gotta agree I was slightly bemused by this diagnosis. The owner wouldn't be embarrassed to 'admit' to laminitis as she is a good friend and also I have a laminitic pony of my own. Vet has not had time to go through diagnosis in great detail yet however he did specify that although the laminae wall was damaged it 'was not laminitis as you know it' maybe he just means it is a mechanical laminitis and not metabolic, if there is such a thing? Horse is spot on in regards to weight (just bought from an eventers yard) he is exercised 5 times a week and our grazing is actually quite poor at the mo! Bit of a mystery to me:rolleyes:
 
yes, mechinical trauma (fast work on hard ground, or even a hooley around the field) can bring on laminitis. As can wormers and vaccinations. Stress can be a major trigger aswell, as it was with my laminitic mare.
 
I am still unsure to what brought chinooks laminitis on. His vaccination was a week prior to him becoming lame and at the same time they changed fields. I wouldn’t say he was obese and I wouldn’t have said his feed was over the top.

Yet at the same time even my vet couldn’t diagnose it as laminitis…..
When he eventually went to the large animal hospital it took them 48 hours before they diagnosed………

Wouldn’t always say its down to owner error
 
Sounds like mechanical laminitis if that description has been used. Can't remember exactly how it was described to me, but it was something along the lines of being "technically laminitis but not with a metabolic cause". I think some people shy away from using the term laminitis if it's not metabolic as that's what tends to spring to mind when it's said.
 
I would lay money that metabolism is also a factor in most of those cases too :)
 
If the comment was made for me then yes since having Chinook pts I have questioned myself 110 times a day to the way he was kept and what I could have changed. Yet he wasn’t classed as fat. Or had high concentrate feeds.

I also question why my own vet couldn’t diagnose him and after 2 weeks he was sent to the large animal hospital which upon arrival took x rays. I sat with the vet and said could it be stress laminitis and got a firm no. 48 hours later they tell me its laminitis.
Nearly 3 weeks in, he had a very poor chance of survival and had stupidly had flexion tests from vets day in day out to try and assess his condition. So yes it was all my fault as an owner…
 
Nookster said:
Was that meant for me angelfben?
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No :confused: I was just agreeing that mechanical laminitis can be brought on in all sorts of situations. My horse brought it on himself by having a temper tantrum and stomping around on a concrete surface, and also probably partly stress. I was rolling my eyes at the nightmare that my horse can be :eek:
 
Yann said:
I would lay money that metabolism is also a factor in most of those cases too :)
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I'm with you on that one Yann :) Call me mad but I'm kind of skeptical of true mechanical laminitis. I for one believe that there is always some kind of metabolic issue going on in the background that then makes it more susceptible to 'mechanical' laminitis.

I now also believe that people underestimate the effects grass can have on their horses. I'm not having a dig at anyone btw. It's just what I have learned after my skinny horse who was on restricted grazing (and fed only hay & hi-fi lite + supplements) got laminitis. I think this the grazing in this country is not really suited to horses imo.
 
I now also believe that people underestimate the effects grass can have on their horses
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I'm 100% with you on that too. If my slim, fit, hard working cob fed a supposedly optimum diet and barefoot trimmed can come down with sore feet and raised pulses due to the grazing, then anything can, it just might not show up as clearly with shoes on. There's also too much direct evidence that weak, flared and collapsing feet, as often seen on Tb's and the like for example are a result of too much of the wrong sort of grass (and bucket feeds) as well.
 
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