Napping when jumping - A Eureka moment!

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gypsygold

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Jan 4, 2005
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I have had a few problems with our horse, whom my son and I share. This horse has a fantastic jumping ability but has sometimes stopped for what appears to be no reason. He was lacking a bit of a confidence (he is 5, 6 this year) so we went back to doing smaller jumps and he has been regularly competing unaffiliated over 1'6" to 2' courses to make sure we arent just overfacing him. He has been placed in 10 out of 12 classes (7 of which were
1st to 3rd) so basically I dont think hes struggling but am not planning to push on too fast.

Now occasionally we have had some bad stops at fences, no particular fence no particular height, it could happen out somewhere else or in our own field and I was struggling to see if there was a deining factor and I have at last realised the problem:) .

If there are other horses/ponies stood watching he will usually not jump. The thing is he waits till he has practically lifted his front feet off the floor your just taking up jumping position and bang - stop dead. It is not easy to stay on. Lets say he has it sussed:rolleyes:

He has done this at home when our other pony has been stood watching, at xc lesson, at SJ lesson, and SJ comp, when my son tried to do a relay with his sister. The common factor has always been horses stood nearby watching.

The odd thing is if the horses are all moving about (not neccesariliy following each other) but like in a collecting ring, or lesson if they are riding ride and filing off to jump he is fine, or in an indoor arena on his own with no others in sight (which is why he has done well at the comps this winter), but if they are just stood at the side watching he just refuses to jump. My son was having a group lesson last night and the instructor thought the pony was scared of the jump but I could see he had his focus on the others.

It is so frustrating because this horse really seems to enjoy his jumping just doesnt seem to like the others not having to do anything! It is clearly a napping senario but quite a specific one. I'm currently patting my own back having sussed the problem now I just need t work out how to get over it:eek:

Well having rambled on about my eureka moment I was wondering if .....
You have ever come across this before?
Did it get better? (Currently thinking of selling :p him as a hack)
Is it likely to improve (have you had a nappy jumper who later just decides to just get on with it?)

Summer outdoor SJ comps are going to be a nightmare if I cant sort this out!
 
I've never heard of that before ! But you can fix it, quite easily, I'd think. youhave to enlist the help of one child or another, on another horse, and use them as the 'staring horse' :) Start small, have the starer horse watch you trot 20 m circles, then trot 20m circles over a pole, watch you over a line of trot poles .. just build it up - it's perhaps just nerves on his part that have becoem a useful habit for him.
 
Thanks Kate for your reply I was beginning to think it I was a lost cause:rolleyes: I think thats all I can do isn't it, it just seems to be such a specific behaviour to being watched - perhaps he's just shy;).

I am really pleased that I have found what causes the behaviour at least I can begin to think how to get to the bottom of it:D
 
I horse can stop for a lot of reasons, but most can be traced back to something the rider is doing. Are you dropping him right before the fence, taking your leg off, or overfacing him? For some horses, even an unsure feeling from the rider can cause the horse to second-guess a jump and stop. If you expect him to refuse in the company of other horses, he may pick up on your unease and it becomes a self-fulfilling prophesy. Unless it's that he's reluctant to leave the other horses (that is, you're jumping away from them-- an even then, you can almost always get a horse to jump if you're firm enough), I would seriously doubt that he's "self conscious" about jumping in front of other horses. Horses just simply do not think like that-- people do.
Of course, I can't say that the problem is strictly the rider's fault, however I also think you are giving your horse emotions which are not possessed by horses. It's something to think about, anyways.
 
Something I may not have made clear is that a horse that learns to stop before jumps will often do it for no good reason if the rider isn't being firm enough or shows the slightest hesitation. That may be what's happening in your case.
 
I dont think it is rider anticipation of a stop is causing it because most of the time he doesnt hesitate in his jumping it just happens sporadically and occasionally. Also I didnt actually make the connection to other horses being present till after he was last jumped on Tuesday evening. It was a eureka moment when laid in bed - I suddenly realised this had been the only common factor on every occasion. So as far as being anticipated - believe its always been a big suprise when its happened:D . Clearly from now on I will have to be careful as I think I know when he's likely to do it.

Overfacing - he will stop at the smalllest crosspole when in this mood, or even a trotting pole but happily jump much higher in other situations :rolleyes:

I think that it would be highly likely that it could be rider error dropping him before his fence. Hwever having watched my son jumping him this is not something he appears to do and he will behave exactly the same with me, and whilst I'm not saying I dont make mistakes I have my stage 3 riding so am not exactly weak in my riding.

I know he wont actually be bothered about the others watching him but I think he is basically napping as he does have these tendencies and also lacks some confidence away from other horses. He will eventually jump the jump but it just takes a few attempts when he realises he just has to do it.

As I say I have only just realised the common factor and will be ready for it next time and be much firmer with him.
 
my mare did this once when she was young, but I wasn't riding so not sure if it was rider error, however it was her first show and she did great in the warm up ring but she just seemed to freeze on her own in the main ring when she was away from everyone, she tends now never to refuse though (just occassionally runs out if I don't use enough leg!)

other than that cant help I'm afraid. I have found theough that if she watches lots of horses jump before her turn she is much more confident...
 
kia does the whole drty stop thing.

he usually refuses the eru first fence I place him into the aftet that he will jump good then he just puts these stops in for no reason and waits until last stride to do so!!

now he just gets a smack on the shoulder going into the first few fences and hes is getting the idea though I'm gonna have to go back to square one as i haven't been riding due to weather.

persevere as I thought that I wouldn't be able to jump him again and now I've found new hope.

Nikki xxxx
 
Thanks for the hope Nik!

It was very baffling initially because we couldnt tie it down to a type or size of fence, indoor and outdoor. It was all a bit bemusing and we didnt want to get too heavy handed because it is very capable but not overly confident with his jumping. If it was just a lack of confidence I knew we had to be careful.

Having now realised the connection with there being other horses around it is clearly him just being nappy so I think we need to make him realise its not acceptable behaviour.

Good to hear things are working out for you.

If you follow this link it shows my son jumping and a very unexpected refusal - although not as close to the fence as he usually gets first. What you cant see is our other pony just out of shot on the left. :rolleyes:

http://www.shgphotographic.co.uk/RECSJ191206/REC SJ 19 12 06 class2 relay/index5.html
 
It's hard to say if it's rider error or not. A napping horse generally doesn't just stop in front of a fence. If they are going to nap, I would feel it would be many strides before the fence (wiggly approach, dead stop 3 or 4 strides out, head tossing, rearing). A stop directly at the fence is usually due to rider error.

What I think could be happening is that he is seeing other horses standing around, looking at them and, being young, thinking about them and not where he is going. All of a sudden there's a jump there and :eek: he stops. When jumping a young horse the rider needs to take on the responsibility of keeping the youngsters attention on him/her and if that attention is not there, the rider should circle away, half-halt, cluck and be proactive in getting the babies full attention before the jump. Learning to stop at this age is bad, especially when he's not stopping because of a spooky set of fillers(which is easily cured by exposure). This would be an indication of a nasty habit forming or already formed and it could take a very confident and talented trainer to reverse it. Even then, the habit of stopping could possibly come back.

A horse that stops is a big problem, whatever the reason. I personally hate a dirty stopper, even if it is due to rider error, I think a well trained horse should be able to help himself sometimes.
 
Trust me Kia doesn't 'wiggle' or 'slow down' he even lifts the legs sometimes the slams them back down.

I have a vid of him doing it but I can't upload it as it is too big and you see him trot very active into it and slam on brakes and shy right in front of it.

Schooling helps but doesn't solve the problem, sometimes you have to be firm and if they learn not to do it then as long as no downright cruelty has happened the there is no harm except the kiddie wont get hurt!!

Your welcome GC just keep the wee mans confidence up as mine hit an all time low and that was the worst/hardest part!!!

Nikki xxxx
 
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gypsygold said:
I dont think it is rider anticipation of a stop is causing it because most of the time he doesnt hesitate in his jumping it just happens sporadically and occasionally. Also I didnt actually make the connection to other horses being present till after he was last jumped on Tuesday evening. It was a eureka moment when laid in bed - I suddenly realised this had been the only common factor on every occasion. So as far as being anticipated - believe its always been a big suprise when its happened:D . Clearly from now on I will have to be careful as I think I know when he's likely to do it.

Overfacing - he will stop at the smalllest crosspole when in this mood, or even a trotting pole but happily jump much higher in other situations :rolleyes:

I think that it would be highly likely that it could be rider error dropping him before his fence. Hwever having watched my son jumping him this is not something he appears to do and he will behave exactly the same with me, and whilst I'm not saying I dont make mistakes I have my stage 3 riding so am not exactly weak in my riding.

I know he wont actually be bothered about the others watching him but I think he is basically napping as he does have these tendencies and also lacks some confidence away from other horses. He will eventually jump the jump but it just takes a few attempts when he realises he just has to do it.

As I say I have only just realised the common factor and will be ready for it next time and be much firmer with him.
Click to expand...
I totally agree with you. My horse is doing exactly the same as realised this after reflecting back on group sessions etc. as soon as others are stood doing nothing he hesitates and naps. When all moving together and well spaced, no problem at all. I know this is an old post but I hope you managed to resolve this as itā€™s something I will be working on.
 
After preliminary exercises, Tik Maynard set up a line of jumps and an upturned barrel at the end. He put a treat on the barrel .
 
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šŸ˜ŠšŸ˜‚ thatā€™s brilliant with the treat. Hope he doesnā€™t expect to stop after every jump for a treat.
 
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