How to encourage my cob to work from behind?

Alice25

Alice25

...is now horseless :(
Feb 18, 2005
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Scottish Borders
Wasn't really sure whether to put this in Training of the horse or rider :p

I'm in the process of bringing my cob Alfie back into work after the winter. Personally I feel we've come a long way; I always feel very safe on him, and can even get him past the most frightening of rocks ( :p ) and we no longer go along at snails pace, thanks to lots of transitions!

But he does have problems working properly from behind and is very on the forehand. I'm a bit confused about the advice I've been given so far. I've been told that I need to ride him firmly into a strong contact, and that I need to ride him slowly on a loose rein.

He's not had very much schooling - I bought him as a happy hacker and he'd only been in an arena about twice in his life. Since he came to live with me that's increased and we've had some lessons, but we've certainly not done a huge amount. We don't want to go Grand Prix - I just want to make our hacks more enjoyable for us both :)

We don't have access to an arena, and I won't be having lessons on him until our new towbar arrives, which should hopefully be soon! :rolleyes:

He's also in a Wintec, and I've heard a lot of bad things about them recently. I've never noticed any problems with mine, but this could be (without sounding soppy) because I have such a lovely horse. Hoping to get it checked soon, but will have to find someone new as my old fitter has moved. She always said it was fine when she checked it, but if she fitted it in the first place... well, let's just say I don't want to be hindering him instead of helping him.

So... advice please? :p:)
Oh, and a picture as a reward for reading all that

Stillstandingsmall.jpg
 
Nothing constructive to say... Just wanted to say what a lovely boy :)

Think your saddle could possibly be a little too far forward? Not 100% sure but I would try it a bit further back could be too much weight on the front end causing him to go on the forehand? (I'm not saying your heavy just saying the weight won't be central if you know what I mean?)
 
Alfie is lovely, what a smart looking boy :)

Just to say that Poohsmate on here does saddle fitting and is currently fixing what seems like half the horses in Scotland who were being tolerant and patient in wonky saddles :eek: (well, half the horses in Scotland whose owners come on here). Who knows, he may travel past the Borders on his way to get to us... you could PM him and see. He also does Bowen treatments which Alfie might like anyway even if saddle is fine ;)

ETA to answer the original question, my hoss is really still a bit of a baby and hasn't done much, and we - like you - don't really have facilities. What worked for us was teaching the boy lateral moves, starting with sort of western disengage the hindquarters, moving on to leg yield and shoulder fore, then shoulder in. To do all of these, the horse has to step deep under themselves with their hinds so it is a good exercise :)
 
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The key to getting a horse off the forehand is lots of transitions (halt to walk, walk to halt is a brilliant one) and lots and lots of leg. Like you I have no school to work in but I still school on a hack (just find a really quiet rd or bridle way for non progressive transitions) Also don't let him get stuck in one pace, as soon as you feel him leaning and not working from behind change pace. Keep him thinking and wondering whats coming next.

As for contact, IMO it should be light and elastic as always. It needs to be enough to stop him running through and falling on the forehand but light enough so as not to cause a battle. I think a really strong contact will only make him back off the bit.

You sound like you have made a really good start with him, so persevere and good luck with him. He is beautiful :)
 
echo cappal dubh - lots of easy lateral moves - on the ground first, then when you're good in the saddle from a halt. After these you'll see your horse is a lot lighter in the hand, and more supple through his body with better weight distriibution.

move the front feet around the hind feet
move the hind feet around the front feet
move horse sideways
reverse horse lightly backwards

These will all soften & flex horse up, and the front feet move, sideways and backup will get weight off front feet / forequarters.

good luck :)
 
don't believe all the hype about wintecs :rolleyes: they do fit some horses! have you had someone check your saddle? there's a good saddler down your way, think he's based in lauder? i'll have to go look up his name again.... lots of transitions and half halts will get alfie carrying his weight more on his hind quarters :)
 
I agree about the Wintec comment from eventerbabe. Wintecs do fit some horses.

Have a look at this thread here was gives a fantastic illustration of what the potential problems are. Pinkslady posts are the ones to pay attention to. On the second page are the illustrations to show you exactly the problems she describes.

My horse had a problem with her Wintec but was so good natured it took a while for dopey old me to pick up on it :rolleyes:

Anyway have a look at that thread about how the back panels are too steeply angled and see if you think it might apply to your horse.

Good luck with the schooling. It sounds like you are going through the same thing I am at the moment :)
 
Thanks everyone for your advice and comments :D

I'll have a look at that thread Joyscarer, thank you - and then maybe go out and have a good saddle examination!
eventerbabe, that would be great if you could find his name... if I can't find anyone local I just might just have to drop poohsmate a line ;)

I'm actually really looking forward to making more progress with him now :)
 
Your saddle is a Wintec cob saddle by the look of it, not a wintec 500, so I won't run off screaming;) They can be good fits for wide cobby horses, so you might be in luck.

Joyscarer said:
Wintecs do fit some horses
Click to expand...

I've yet to met one;) (as poohsmate will agree) Actually, no scrap that - I know ONE horse who's wintec 500 fits - he's an archtypical TB.

Only thing really obvious from the picture is it's sitting right up his neck!:eek: It's often because it's too narrow but also becuase the horse is bum high (alfie!) has a big backend pushing it forwards (alfie!) and little shoulder and withers to hold it back (alfie!). Most importabtly for him however is the girthing arrangement. He looks to have a forwards girth groove (most cobs like his do) and that drags the saddle forwards. The tighter you do the girth up the more the girth pulls it forwards (girth wants to sit right behind his elbows, saddle needs to sit a good 6" further back, girth wins:rolleyes: )

What girth straps do you have it on? I would definitly be using the point and first strap, so the girth hangs more out the front of the saddle and doesn't drag it forwards as much.

Other than that, what others said.

I would first work on getting him going forwards off the leg. So he goes as soon as you out your leg on and you don't have to nag. Lots of trasitions and a stick helps, as does clicker training to reward him for going frowards.

After that I'd work on him going forwards at all times into a gentle contact.
 
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