haylage - hosing it/soaking it/ reducing sugar & risks?

[BlueWicked]

i have heard that wet haylage is a botchulism risk?

the most recent large bale opened at my yard seems much richer and more moist than previous bales. My freinds horse has been coughing as well, so she has been hosing down her haynet directly before feeding, which seems to have helped. I wonderd if hosing it down was ok if you feed it straight away? Would doing so help to reduce the sugar content / richness and thus fizzy-making rolleyes properties of it?

thanks

 

[cvb]

Botulism is a bacteria - hosing it is not going to make any difference. If a bale has been opened, any soil contamination can mean the botulism bacteria gets a chance and then your horse is at risk. This is one of the reasons why you have to be careful about bales that have been split, or are opened but not used quickly.

I am not sure why you would hose haylage ? Hosing is normally about getting dust etc out of the way and haylage doesn't tend to be dusty because of the way it is cut, processed etc ?

 

[BlueWicked]

Botulism is a bacteria - hosing it is not going to make any difference. If a bale has been opened, any soil contamination can mean the botulism bacteria gets a chance and then your horse is at risk. This is one of the reasons why you have to be careful about bales that have been split, or are opened but not used quickly.

I am not sure why you would hose haylage ? Hosing is normally about getting dust etc out of the way and haylage doesn't tend to be dusty because of the way it is cut, processed etc ?

thanks for the info about botulism.

this haylage must be dusty then because as I said my friend's horse was coughing until is was hosed I was also asking in my post about hosing it to reduce sugars?

 

[intouch]

I think you'd have to soak it for a while to reduce the sugars, don't think hosing would be enough. We steam our hay to stop coughing, but I can't see how hayledge would be dusty. Strange.

 

[cvb]

and the longer you soak it, the more time for nasties to grow...

if I remember right the research on soaking hay said that when you soak the hay for long periods, the resulting water is comparable in chemicals etc to *sewage* (euuuuu)

 

[Nookster]

and the longer you soak it, the more time for nasties to grow...

if I remember right the research on soaking hay said that when you soak the hay for long periods, the resulting water is comparable in chemicals etc to *sewage* (euuuuu)

Can agree with that after soaking hay for chinook when he was ill - the water was disgusting afterwards. Also hay went off so what ever was soaked and not eaten that night had to chucked.

Never heard of soaking haylage to be honest - stuff i used to use was never dusty.

 

[cvb]

this might help explain ?
http://www.horseandhound.co.uk/horsecare/1370/38773.html

I know you can get less brain-blowing versions of haylage. Is your locally made and has it been analysed ? the sugars may not be an issue... and by soaking you could create more problems than you solve ?

If you have a sugar-intolerant horse and are worried - I'd either swap to something you can rely on being ok, or get it analysed ?

 

[BlueWicked]

problem is it is in big bales at our yard. it is made by the yard... and this latest bale which has been opened is richer - some of the horses have got fizzy on it. It IS dusty as well - I have been putting mouldy/crumbly bits of it on the muck heap The haylage is included in the cost of livery.

So would hosing it off not help at all with the sugars?

 

[cvb]

problem is it is in big bales at our yard. it is made by the yard... and this latest bale which has been opened is richer - some of the horses have got fizzy on it. It IS dusty as well - I have been putting mouldy/crumbly bits of it on the muck heap The haylage is included in the cost of livery.

So would hosing it off not help at all with the sugars?

eek ! if there are mouldy bits - run away VERY fast !!

and in terms of sugar - soaking will leach various things out of whatever you put in to it and into the water. I was trying to see if anyone had written up anything on this - but it seems to be illogical enough that no one has researched it. (everything just comments on how you don't *need* to soak it).

Remember that the higher moisture content means that if you weigh the haylage and feed by weight - you will actually be feeding less volume of haylage than the same weight of hay.

My personal and humble opinion - if this is just a *risk* ("some" horses got fizzy) I would really not risk soaking - you don't know if it will have the effect you want.

But I can not emphasise more - do NOT have anything to do with mouldy haylage.

ETA: to clarify - I don't just mean the bits you can SEE are mouldy. If there is mould in the bale, the whole lot is a BIG risk.

ETA2: *hosing* is not going to have an effect on sugars. To leach the sugars you would need to soak for a good time - and then you risk all the nasties growing as well.

 

[pinkypug1]

Ive been feeding haylage for 15 yrs most bales have been great but some i open have the odd bit of mould. Ive removed the mould and fed the rest of the bale and ive never had a problem! everyone i know does this be it on competition yards, livery yards or riding schools and ive never known a horse to die or get ill. If the bale is moulded right through etc then yes disgard but i wouldnt just for a small piece. But every one can make their own choice on what they feed and dont feed their horse!!

 

[Roofio]

A lot of hay and haylage round here this year is very dry and dusty thanks to the rubbish weather. I had some hay that i had to soak to wash the soil off, and the haylage wasn't much better.

I'm guessing if haylage is in with the livery there's no option to have hay?

I wont feed haylage again, am all for low-sugar now

 

[cvb]

Ive been feeding haylage for 15 yrs most bales have been great but some i open have the odd bit of mould. Ive removed the mould and fed the rest of the bale and ive never had a problem! everyone i know does this be it on competition yards, livery yards or riding schools and ive never known a horse to die or get ill. If the bale is moulded right through etc then yes disgard but i wouldnt just for a small piece. But every one can make their own choice on what they feed and dont feed their horse!!

thing about risk is that it is a bit like playign russian roulette. most times you will pull the trigger and nothing happens. But every so often you'll pull the trigger and you got the bullet - with devastating effects. But you can't tell which bale has the bullet in it - so you manage that risk by watching for bales that are likely to be compromised.

The risk is high enough that horse owners in Sweden have the option to vaccinate against botulism. Not sure why that is not available here.

 

[pinkypug1]

CVB- that very true but from talking to others i think the bale has to be quite bad to pose risk if the bale is sweet smelling and not too wet a small piece of mould once removed from the bale the rest should be fine.

As for the vaccination if one is available else where like you say why isnt it available here i'll have to ask my neighbour is a top horse vet??

 

[AengusOg]

Botulism in haylage is caused by soil contamination. It is a bacterium, as has already been said.

The white mould on some bales of haylage is a fungus.......a totally different thing.

I usually pull the white, wet mouldy areas off and, after they have lain for a day or so, I offer them to the horses and they eat quite a bit of it, leaving only the hardish white patches.

The bits I discard are any which have blue dusty mould. This type of mould usually releases clouds of spores into the air when disturbed. I definitely think that would be bad for horses.

I feed bigbale haylage most winters and never have any problems. Sometimes it's the same colour as hay and fairly dry, and sometimes it's darker and fairly moist. A bale lasts ten to twelve days as long as the weather isn't too warm. If a bale starts to heat I open it out and it lasts that way.

If I opened a bale and it had black or pink mouldy patches all over I would discard it altogether, particularly if it didn't smell sweet.

Obviously if the horses turned their noses up at any and refused to eat it I would offer them another bale.

 

[cvb]

CVB- that very true but from talking to others i think the bale has to be quite bad to pose risk if the bale is sweet smelling and not too wet a small piece of mould once removed from the bale the rest should be fine.

As for the vaccination if one is available else where like you say why isnt it available here i'll have to ask my neighbour is a top horse vet??

I lived in Sweden for 3 years - with a horse - and I also do not understand why the vaccination is not available over here. Seems very strange to me.

AengusOg has commented about the fungus vs bacteria - which of course is entirely correct. But the fact that fungus has had a chance to flourish means the bale has not been kept as it should to prevent issues with botulism.

Heck - at the end of the day it is your choice whether to take the risk or not. But I wouldn't.