Further to Holli's ridiculous price - what to do now?

Sarah-B

Sarah-B

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Oct 8, 2005
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So, after yesterdays ridiculous price offer (she wanted £2250 for a 12.2HH NF that has vices) I spent the afternoon e-mailing Holli's owner back and forth.

When I said I couldn't afford her, the owner said things can stay as they are for now, but could I make an offer? So I told her that we hadn't really considered buying a 2nd pony which was why we were loaning, I advised her I thought her price was sky high and told her even if we could afford it we would only pay about £500. I said Holli better go back.

I've then had a couple more e-mails with the owner saying she wants us to keep Holli and she wishes she hadn't said anything - she says she doesn't want to sell to anyone other than us and if we can't buy her then we can continue with a long term loan. She says she was worrying about us suddenly deciding we didn't want her and giving her back, but if we are not going to do that (and we've never given any indication of it before) then she is happy to continue with the loan.

Now I'm not sure what to do, if she was just for pottering about on then I would keep her, but the thing is I was going to pay to send her away to be trained to harness, buy an exercise vehicle and harness. Of course I am reluctant to spend all that now the owner has made me feel insecure!!

In one respect I empathise as when my ex-horse was on loan years ago, I asked if the loanee wanted to buy and when she said she couldn't then we carried on as we were, but on the other I'm worried that I will spend a load to get Holli driving and then she will be taken away.

So, what do you think I should do?
 
What a predicament. I think the owner realises the price is unjustified and she's just trying it on. She's probably offered you long-term loan as she's realised that nobody would pay that amount for her. Perhaps you could just keep on at her and she may eventually take the £500. Good luck.
 
get a contract from a solicitor about what you will pay for her should you be able to afford her in the future. also that you will get first refusal at that price if she decides to sell. then and only then would i agree to keep the pony. if she wont sign the contrct then the pony would go back
 
it's a difficult one as it comes down to trust really. obviously if you invest in holli's training etc then in a couple of years she is easily worth £1000 or more as a good ride/drive pony - but that is your time and also your costs - when I sent ponies away to be schooled it was £105 a week and that was years ago, so in a way you are providing this service.

maybe you could agree on £500 as a payment with a further sum at a future date?

it's unsettling when this has been raised as you wonder whether you can believe/trust but then you have to look at it from the other side in that the owner trusts you with her pony.
 
if you want to keep her, i would get something drawn up with the help of a lawyer (if you're a bhs member i believe you can get a free legal consultation with an equine lawyer) about the term of the loan - say a year at a time, the notice either party has to give to end it, and what will happen with purchase price if you add considerable value to her and she is sold.

is she that good that she is worth all this hassle though?
 
it sounds like she lost her confidence because she'd heard a story from someone else / someone had warned her that the problem with loaning is that you can end up iwth a pony back unexpectedly. If that is her problem, it's easy enough to remedy by agreeing in writing with her that you'll give her at least three months' notice if you want to return HOlli. From her point of view, it's fair enough that at some point the pony may be worth more because of the work you've done - you are getting a free pony and that's your benefit, and any improvement in the pony (as well as knowing she's in a good home) is her benefit
 
It's difficult deciding what to do. Thing is she might only be worth £500 now, but after all the training and work you are going to put into her she will probably be worth more in time and more appealing to other buyers. What if she decided to sell on then? Could you afford it? Would you willing to pay an increased price for her? I would definitely do what others have said on here and get a contract drawn up stating that if she is sold in future you will get so much of the price because of the training etc you have put into her.
 
a friend of mine has had a loan for 3 years now. he was an expensive field ornament before they took him on (hes a 16.2 arab x WB) and now he is doing 3DE, dressage and SJ comps and winning. they are negotiating to get a portion of his price when he is sold because they have put all the effort into training him.

i think maybe you should consider the same thing, if they are going to sell her as soon as she is trained, and you have put all the money into her training. either thet, or as Kanuma suggested get a contract, but state that you are to keep her for a set period of time after the training is over in order to get the benefit from it?

i dont really know though - its a tricky one.
 
I don't really know much about finance and everything, and your relationship with Holli's owner. But couldn't you somehow ask her for a contribution to the costs of teaching her how to drive. In the long run it would make her worth more and would be better if the lady wanted to sell. If finally you did buy her, you could give the lady back the money she contributed, so that she doesn't loose out.

Sorry if this makes no sense.
 
I's be inclined to say to her that you will buy the pony at £500 or send her back. If she's happy to leave her on loan, it can't be about money now, but you run the risk that you put the time, effort and money into making her a more valuable pony, only to have her sold out from under you...

Ross
 
I'd agree with Ross - Buy her or semd her back. Don't be nasty about it - explain your reasons (that you're wanting to put a lot of time and effort into her and you're not willing to out the money in the let her go.).

If she won't agree to that, get a permenent contract drawn up and state that if she is to be sold, you are to get first oppertunity at £500 or similar.
 
Everyone's given lots of good advice and I have to say that I agree with Ross and Pink's Lady. If the owner only wants you to buy the pony and she's happy to (she says) continue the loan without worrying about money, then why can't she accept £500? At least she knows the pony is in the home she wants her to have and she will not be having to worry about having her back. Personally I too would offer the woman £500 and tell her she can have her pony back if she cannot accept and explain that you cannot afford to spend a fortune on a pony that could be taken from you at her will.
 
I agree, unfortunately she's put the doubt in your mind now. If she's willing to sell the pony to you now, or give you a lifetime loan then why not sell her to you for a reasonable price?
I have a horse on loan and he's not for sale. If he was for sale then his loaners could have him very cheaply, but the reason I have him on loan is because you never know, one day I might need him to come back to me. If he'd been sold I wouldn't have that option.
My friend has just had her loan horse snatched back, she got an unstarted 2 yr old and the owner now has a nicely backed and riding on 4 year old to sell. It was a lifetime loan contract, but who would be able to afford to go to court to fight after the owner has turned up with a box, loaded and left?
 
haven't been on here in quite a while but seen this thread and found it quite interesting.
Regarding getting a legal contract drawn up that will still put you in an awkward position.
1) Cost of a solicitor to draw up contract
2) Cost of solicitor if contract broken (a standard letter could cost you dearly)
3) Cost of court case if it cames to that
4) All the heartache and worry

Personnaly I wouldn't put a lot of money and time into a loan horse/pony in this situation untill I was absolutely sure the horse/pony was not going to be taken away from me.
Would the owner not contribute toward the training and the equipment?

Good luck on the outcome and hopefully everything works in your favour
 
I'll have to agree here. buy her or send her back.
I understand that you're attached to Holli and dont want to loose her, but imagine how much worse itd be if you have her longer. th bond will get stronger and if the owner takes her back then the pain will be worse.
i dont mean to sound depressing but i think its true.
best of luck
 
OK, have e-mailed the owner again today and she has offered to come over at the weekend (she lives about 60 miles away) with a revised contract that states:

If within the 18mths following Holli being trained to harness the owner decides to sell her to a third party, then the owner must refund Sarah half the cost of the training.

She is adamant we can keep her for as long as we like, but I dunno - the concern that she'll want to sell her later on is still there - I suppose at least with the above clause I wouldn't be *too* out of pocket....
 
How much is the training going to cost? And what about the equipment etc? It doesn't sound like a very good deal to me..

I do agree with the others to either buy her (somehow) or send her back. If this happens again 18months down the line you'll be even more attached, and you're going to spend the rest of your time now wondering when that email/phonecall is going to come. :(
 
I wouldn't agree to it, 18months, you'll be out all the costs it took to keep her and half the coats of training and equipment. I wouldn't say shes worth more than £500, if the owner cares about the home then she wouldn't care what price she sold her at - sounds like shes looking for money, either a lump sum, long loan or sale price when trained.

I'd get out of there.
 
The same principles apply to what I said earlier, what is there to make her pay half, when the time comes that is when trouble starts. Money is the rath of most disagreements and do you want all that hassle.

Just because someone says they will give back half the training fee and state it in wriitng does not mean they will actually do it.
Also what about the harness and carriage. Would she pay half and would she expect to keep it?

This sounds like trouble...
 
I wouldn't do the 18 month contract - she can still sell her any time and you would still have spent the money.
I agree with Ross and Pink's Lady.
 
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