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Interesting farrier visit

Discussion in 'Hoof Care' started by newforest, Aug 8, 2017.

  1. newforest

    newforest Opinion, a view not always based on knowledge.

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    She is unshod, worked six days a week on various surfaces. Sand, roads, track, fields and gravel. No heat, pulses, flare, bruising, separation, thrush. Good hooves.
    The conversation goes to her being footy when in season. The vet has logged this as 1/10 lame, stiff behind not tracking up. They know she struggles with hormones.

    The vet wondered about LGL and this is where it got interesting. Farrier hadn't heard of it. A footsore horse needs shoes unless you have just taken them of and they are readjusting. We don't need shoes because she is a sound as a pound when hormones not involved.

    My thinking is that LGL is the very mild first stage that waves a flag and if seen and sorted can stop it developing.
    She goes a little footy everytime she comes into season, so for the past six years. ( anyone thinking of getting a mare, get a gelding:D)

    So what's the difference between hormonal footsore and LGL footsore (without meaning to sound totally dim this appears to be a new term that's appeared since I got into horses?)
    Anyone have a footy hormonal mare only for those few days?
     
  2. Jessey

    Jessey Well-Known Member

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    A very good point. I don't think there is any difference, LGL is LGL. o me, by definition, lami, actue or chronic, can be low grade or severe and it simply describes inflammation and degradation of the laminae ...bit like 'colic' just describes belly pain not the cause of the belly pain.
    ETA I think Jess' problems have some relationship to her insane hormones, sadly I can't tell as she's in season 11.5 months of the year, but I swear her crazy hormones and PPID are somehow linked and that is in turn linked to this weird on off lameness we've had.
     
  3. KP nut

    KP nut I'd rather be riding.

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    I have never heard of LGL linked to hormones, or foot soreness linked to seasons. I would have thought 'lameness' linked to seasons would be because other areas are sore and she is just protecting herself. I walk funny when crippled with period pain too! But it's very interesting that Jessey thinks this is linked in Jess. Not my area at all but as owner of an on-off grumpy mare, I would be curious to know more.
     
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  5. newforest

    newforest Opinion, a view not always based on knowledge.

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    She hoof tested fine and farrier and I felt that the issue with her is her muscles in her back end. He said it's something I will need to manage around as it sounds normal for her, which to be fair it is.

    @KPnut we don't get grumpy. We get sleepy, cosy and cuddles, nicker and licks. If anything wants a duvet day and I hate the term it's her.
    But I think bringing in would just make her stiffen even more.
     
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  6. Jessey

    Jessey Well-Known Member

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    If she's hoof testing fine then she's not foot sore, probably right its elsewhere.
     
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  7. newforest

    newforest Opinion, a view not always based on knowledge.

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    I wonder if Devils Claw would ease her discomfort?
     
  8. Lollykay

    Lollykay Member

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    That isn't necessarily true. Horses are a prey animal and some are more stoic than others, meaning passing a hoof tester test isn't always an assurance that all is well inside the hoof.

    My Insulin resistant horse passed the hoof testers, in the vet's hands, with flying colors and a week later he foundered on both fronts. 8-9 degrees on one hoof, 5 degrees on the other ------ measuring from the dorsal wall so the founder was severe on the LF and pretty bad on RF.

    I no longer take stock in hoof testers --- show me the x-Rays instead:)
     
  9. Jessey

    Jessey Well-Known Member

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    I know all about stoic horses giving very little reaction to hoof testers, I have one like that, but even the most stoic you will generally see the twitch of a back muscle or something subtle, so subtle often that it would be deemed a pass if you don't realise the horse is that way but @newforest knows her girl like the back of her hand so I doubt anything has been overlooked and correct me if I'm wrong but tilly is normally very forward in telling you if anything is wrong?
     
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  10. Jane&Ziggy

    Jane&Ziggy Learning together!

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    @newforest Devil's Claw is great for certain types of pain and inflammation. If you want to see if she would benefit from it, order a small quantity of the dried roots from someone like my friend Catherine www.naturallyanimals.co.uk . If she will take them from your hand and eat them, rather than spit them out - they are very bitter even for horses! - then she would probably benefit from a liquid decoction added to her feed. I use James Hart Devil's Claw extract but there are others. Make sure they are just Devil's Claw though, people like Global Herbs tend to bulk them out with all sorts of cheaper things.
     
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  11. newforest

    newforest Opinion, a view not always based on knowledge.

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    That's for that link. Will look into that now. I want to avoid anything with stuff added unnecessarily.
     
  12. Lollykay

    Lollykay Member

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    Well, I am glad your are so up-to-speed and know your own horse so well ---- not every one does:)

    No,need to get your hackles up, it was merely a suggestion. -- how nice of you to take someone else's part when the well-intended comment wasn't even about your horse.

    This forum certainly is not friendly to helpful suggestions from what you deem outsiders is it -
     
  13. carthorse

    carthorse Well-Known Member

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    I remember many many years ago that some people would breed from laminitic mares as a cure. Apparently the mares would often not get laminitis when in foal & often wouldn't get it after either so would be sold on as riding ponies. This would suggest a possible link to hormones to me, Whether it was good for the bloodlines is another matter, I'd worry that this practice led to more laminitis prone ponies being bred.
     
  14. carthorse

    carthorse Well-Known Member

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    I'm not taking sides here Lollykay, but I don't see how there was anything unfriendly about Jessey's reply & it's not as though she was saying your advice wasn't good - like you I have an IR cob & I want x-rays for just the same reason. Your reply re Jessey's post does sound tetchy though, and I feel the criticism of the forum as a whole is unwarranted. We do have some members who don't get on, but that's life, and it's a forum for people's experiences & opinions not one where only one view is acceptable.
     
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  15. Jessey

    Jessey Well-Known Member

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    My hackles weren't up. The reason I replied was that you had quoted me and I wasn't trying to play anyone else's part. I wouldn't say a negative hoof tester is always a negative, far from it, but I've been following Newforest's journey with Tilly for some years now and she has often told us how sensitive she is to things so I made the comment with that in mind.
     
  16. newforest

    newforest Opinion, a view not always based on knowledge.

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    I now of people who have done just this. During the pregnancy they don't get laminitis. Either side they do.
    Whether that's the hormonal changes or because anything the horse eats is being absorbed by the foal and they are not getting excess sugar etc from the diet?

    They have recently linked cushings to Lami haven't they so maybe they will look into this more.

    It took me two years to get the vet to agree to regumate for her!
     
  17. carthorse

    carthorse Well-Known Member

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    Laminitis in autumn is a classic cushings symptom, and without medication is almost impossible to control.

    I was told that following a foal or two some mares would stay laminitis free with sensible management, maybe because some of the hormone changes stayed longer term?
     
  18. Jessey

    Jessey Well-Known Member

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    From memory, the new reasearch says 90% of lami cases have an underlying metabolic problem.
     
  19. newforest

    newforest Opinion, a view not always based on knowledge.

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    Third small handful. @Jane&Ziggy
    She is also wanting thistle tops which I will tidy up that corner and pick the rest for her.
    PicsArt_08-11-02.28.04.jpg
     
  20. newforest

    newforest Opinion, a view not always based on knowledge.

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    Just thought I would add that she has had a full lameness work out at the vet when she injured her collateral ligament.
    They did xray the fronts, nerve block and radiography.
    She was then 2/10 lame but came into season whilst they had her which made her then 3/10.
    So whilst they had her she showed no other signs of anything wrong except what they found.

    The vet is booked and if necessary we will rescan. But unless in season on his arrival she will be sound.
     
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